Tuesday, June 28, 2011

Not Seattle's Best

Generally speaking, I've enjoyed my times in the Seattle region despite some strange cultural expressions among the locals.
This time, I think they've gone too far:
Business is booming for so-called "sexpresso" stands in Kitsap County, where they're busting out all over.


I know, I know... I usually take a live and let live stand on issues of personal morality, consenting exchange, and exploitation of men's desire to ogle naked breasts... but God damn it, I'm drawing a line here.

We need to do more to protect the public, and shield our children, from having to view this sort of thing.
This is beyond an assault upon righteousness.
It also is a blight upon our culture, an assault on womanhood, and a bad example for our daughters. An obscenity.

There is no shame left when a young, previously attractive women can pour coffee in public view while showing way more tattoos than is necessary. It's got to stop.


Foxfier said...

All totally predictable since...what... three or so years ago, when they started filing complaints because some of the places-- le gasp!-- let the girls wear two-piece tops. (Not like most of the stands have AC.)

That got it on the news, that started folks to thinking "ooh... skin= sales" and putting signs on their shops that said "Bikini Baristas!!!!"

That led to legal challenges that were-- of course-- shot down, because if you decide a bikini top is too lewd for public you're going to have one HECK of a lot of teens to arrest in the mall in the summer. Get over that hurdle, and... *points at video*

Gino said...

and then ALL little girls will want tattoos. its unspeakable...

Foxfier said...

This is Seattle. The 50 year old business lady that runs my apartment complex has a tattoo that runs over the top of her foot and up under her business suit.

The "girls want tattoos" train left LONG ago.....

Jade said...

Gino - they have one of these sitting in the parking lot of a gun shop... I told D that all they need is a big screen TV for football and they've got all the manly cliche's in one spot.

The ones I've seen have to have blacked out windows, like a strip club, and only people going all the way up to the window can see in. Thankfully they are generally given a clever title that makes it obvious it's not a family coffee stand.

But then, I'm too much of a coffee snob to go to a one-off oddly named coffee stand anyway. When I buy coffee, it needs to be from a hipster in a proper roasting house who describes the coffee as "wicked good"

Bike Bubba said...

Bare torso. 200F water and 190F coffee. What could POSSIBLY go wrong?

Granted, if a woman is covered with tattoos already, she knows about pain, but this just seems to be begging for workmans' comp actions.....

Palm boy said...

@Bubba, or just really horribly made coffee as the baristas shy away from proper creation conditions.

Gino said...

cold coffee. tattood women. yeah, thats reason enuf for me to stay away.

Foxfier said...

Not like a tank top or Tshirt is much protection from hot water-- heck, bluejeans aren't much protection. Just holds it against the skin.

(Word verification: lumaniti. Um.... is blogger telling me something?)

Bike Bubba said...

Foxfier's part of the conspiracy, I see. :^) (don't worry; it happens when you're gestating)

OK, seriously, having been splashed on bare skin and on clothing with hot water/oil, I'll take even light clothing over bare skin. It at least spreads out the hot liquid and allows the body to deal with it better.

Along another line, who would have anticipated that a young lady willing to bare her torso for the tattoo artist would also be willing to bare her torso for coffee shop customers? Shocker, that.

Foxfier said...

Hehe, I actually thought about it because the nastiest hot water burn- as opposed to steam or oil-- that I ever got was when I spilled a hot drink all over my pantleg.

I'm betting that when it's 100* outside of the shack, most women are going to be willing to risk a slightly worse burn in favor of being slightly cooler. This is all just a result of the bitter jerks they were interviewing a few years ago who were upset that college girls showing chest went over better than middle aged men and older women in tank tops.

Because one or two people tried to use the law as a bludgeon, this was all totally predictable.

Brian said...

Gino's just worried that his daughter will be covered in ink if she stays in Seattle for a while. It's contagious, you know...

Bike Bubba said...

Are there octopi roaming the streets of Seattle, Brian? :^)

Brian said...

No...but that would make an awesome tattoo.

(I actually have a T-shirt of a sea monster destroying the Space Needle that is currently my favorite.)

Gino said...

my daughter is already on alert: dad hates tats on girls.

i think i've got the last remaining 20-somethings who havent been inked yet.
like i tell them... be a rebel. go inkfree.

Foxfier said...

Be REALLY out there-- don't maim yourself beyond two tiny ear-ring holes in the lobe of your ear. (It's nearly unthinkable to be so outrageous as to not even have that!)

Brian said...




my name is Amanda said...

Ha, I'm out there, then. No piercings - none, not even ears - and no tattoos. I used to want to have my ears pierced, but my mom wouldn't allow it until I became old enough to not care anymore. (And by that time I was old enough for it to be a "unique" feature, I admit.) Also I used to want a tattoo, but I could never commit to a location / design. In general, I now dislike tattoos, but I don't particularly care if women (OR MEN) (who aren't my SO) get them. To each their own. My SO teases me about getting a tattoo; I'm not crazy about the idea. I don't think he'd actually do it, though. Too preppy-ish.

I find topless coffee shops (and topless bars, strip clubs, even Hooters) disgusting (because of equality, not morality), but they are clearly the result of a culture that objectifies / sexualizes women. If there was more Feminism in the world, there would be less women getting paid to be nude, period.


Bike Bubba said...

"If there was more Feminism in the world, there would be less women getting paid to be nude, period."

Which explains why prostitution and such is flourishing in feminist-dominated societies in Scandinavia and Germany, and why the porn and strip club industries have flourished in the United States as feminism's claims began to be accepted by more and more Americans.

Sorry, Amanda, but I think the data aren't cooperating very well with your hypothesis, to put it mildly. There may be benefits to feminism, but eliminating strip clubs does not seem to be one of them.

Foxfier said...

While I don't believe it, the feminism= prostitution and strip clubs effect you point out might be some sort of pendulum effect; I think a similar theory has been offered for why feminism somehow means that women are supposed to be OK with being treated as disposable in a physical relationship, but someone holding open a door is offensive.

I think one could build a decent argument based on what it's reasonable to predict will happen in China and India when the lack of girls really hits, and what it's reasonable to predict would happen in the US if there were suddenly a lot fewer women.
(Sex slavery and possibly women becoming property vs more extreme competition for the women there are.)

Gino said...

you will find men dressing better,and showering more often. comeptition does that.

which is moot, cause we all know that woman go after money,anyway.

Amanda: without tats and peircings you are truly a model of proper womanhood for all lil girls to aspire to. i mean that.

Brian said...

Sex work, (very) broadly defined to include any work that makes sex or the suggestion/promise/simulation thereof a commodity for sale (which would include our baristas, here) seems to me to be an inevitability when the supply of female sexuality (not females) is far outstripped by the demand of male sexuality.

Which is to say, everywhere, all the time, regardless of how many men and women there are, or legality. Sex work "floursihes" all over the world. And I don't think feminism has much to do with it...except insofar as feminism acts as a driving force for protecting the safety and autonomy of women, regardless of the type of work in which they engage. I imagine it is better to be working a legal brothel in Berlin or Amsterdam (for example) than to be a "maid" in a society where women are still viewed as property.

Personally, I think nude girls serving coffee (or food) is weird, but mostly harmless, that strip clubs are some of the saddest places I've ever been (I've been to enough to know I don't want to go to any more), and that prostitution is safest when legal and above ground.

Gino said...

i think feminism is a luxury affordable to women who have already found a secure meal ticket.

as a workable system or belief, it will only abound on college campus' to provide meal tickets to professerettes angry at not gettin the promotion, or a date to prom.

Bike Bubba said...

Foxfier; I would suggest that what we see with strip clubs and such is a combination of the sexual revolution and feminism. More or less, when women were told they didn't need the protection of a husband or father, and men were told that they could get the milk (sex) without "buying the cow" in marriage, the stage was set (no pun intended) for the proliferation of porn and strip clubs.

Not that there wasn't prostitution and such at all times before, but a barrier to it being widespread was removed.

Foxfier said...

Sounds right to me, especially seeing the mess it makes by removing things women who don't want this stuff can raise.

Forget the strip clubs-- there are a shocking number of guys who think that giving a girl attention on a dutch date means they "deserve" sex. And a more shocking number of girls who can be manipulated into agreeing. *headdesk*

my name is Amanda said...

Oh crap - I didn't return to check this thread! Well, here we go then:

Bike Bubba - "Which explains why prostitution and such is flourishing in feminist-dominated societies in Scandinavia and Germany, and why the porn and strip club industries have flourished in the United States as feminism's claims began to be accepted by more and more Americans."

I'm not sure how any of the above words constitute "data."

One of the functions of Feminism is to eradicate the sexual objectification of women - as women become to be seen less as objects, fewer people will find things like strip clubs to be palatable. Why do they still exist/flourish? Because Feminism is a bitch that we just got started. :)

(And yes, I do include the last 200 years in "just got started." The Patriarchy has existed for thousands of years.)

Foxfier - "I think a similar theory has been offered for why feminism somehow means that women are supposed to be OK with being treated as disposable in a physical relationship, but someone holding open a door is offensive."

I think things like the above examples demonstrate how the movement is still working itself out, and the slowness of culture in general to accept different ways of thinking.

Re: countries that sex-select babies - I can see the competition thing more than the sex slave thing, but I actually think that China for example will become more diverse, as men seek women from other countries to marry.

Gino - "we all know that woman go after money,anyway"

I can only participate in one argument at a time, Gino!

Brian - I definitely agree that at least Feminism has been a "driving force for protecting the safety and autonomy." And I support any measure that makes sex work safe, and that contributes to sex workers being viewed as fully-formed humans deserving of respect.

...There is the point to be made that perhaps there will always be a need for some people to have a sexual outlet that they pay for. My problem with sex workers how it all ties into notions about femininity and purity, sexual objectification of women, how the vast majority are women, AND how many of those women are actually girls. If the world was a more equal place, maybe prostitution could exist as merely a personal business transaction, and not as a purity metaphor.

Anyway, maybe nude girls serving coffee is mostly harmless, and it's not like I would be a big prude about it, or act embarrassed if I happened to enter the establishment. But on a personal level, as a woman, it makes me uncomfortable. I don't speak for all women, though.

Gino - Dammit, now I will have to argue with you! Well, sort of argue. :)

Okay, I agree with you that Feminism is often a luxury for those who have a "secure meal ticket." But so is any political movement or philosophy.

That said, it's not freaking Communism. It's actually incredibly simple. This is Feminism in a nutshell: Treating women like humans deserving of respect. It means trusting women when they communicate things (and I think the threads on this blog are great at that) and treating women as seriously as we treat men. At the base of it, that's all it is. Very workable into everyday life.

Bike Bubba - Now, I do agree that - what you say about the combination of the sexual revolution and Feminism.

Not that you need me to agree with that. It's just nice to agree with people sometimes.

Foxfier - True dat.

Bike Bubba said...

Amanda: exactly; the union of feminism and the sexual revolution provides fertile ground for strip clubs.

So seeing that feminists don't seem to be, by and large, disavowing the sexual revolution, I'm anticipating not the end of strip clubs featuring women, but more strip clubs featuring men. Probably near Gino's old stomping grounds first. :^)

And ewwww.....it will be "equality" in a way, but ewww....

Foxfier said...

Male strip clubs (for a female audience) will probably stay a niche thing-- I know more guys who hate strip-clubs than women who enjoy male dancers, even with social pressure going the opposite directions. Heck, some of the women who enjoy going to female strip clubs don't enjoy male strippers.
(Drawing only on the straight population to keep it simple.)

Females just tend to be less visual. Compare the number of "naughty fireman" calendars to the number of "naughty nurse" ones.
Conversely, compare the number of romance novels that target men to the number that target women.