tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post8683681478056571908..comments2023-11-30T00:41:47.585-08:00Comments on Shreds: Misses, Elles and ChiennesGinohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09606046924332159076noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-47637995805502930882012-03-01T10:58:54.655-08:002012-03-01T10:58:54.655-08:00I thoroughly enjoyed this post, thank you for putt...I thoroughly enjoyed this post, thank you for putting the work into it.RobertDWoodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12468867977431697913noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-698429415423186142012-02-29T23:56:51.123-08:002012-02-29T23:56:51.123-08:00I took a break from following blog threads, but ju...I took a break from following blog threads, but just wanted to follow up.<br /><br />"Miss" made me feel weird when I was a 22-year old college grad supporting myself (no help from parents) and living in the city (specifically, on a wedding invitation, it made me feel weird). To me, it sounds like something you call a 12-year old girl. If I wasn't married at this point, being called "Miss" at 32 (and even 29, Gino), would feel out-right ridiculous. Unless a very old person was doing the addressing. I mean, too old to correct, out of politeness. I really can't imagine many women from my generation enjoying being called "Miss," though I would leave it to them to discuss how they feel. I grew up in the South (until I was 10) and "Ma'am" was the standard address of respect. Now that I'm a bit older, I've gotten "ma'am" a few times, and though it's jarring to acknowledge that I'm not as young as I used to be (and apparently don't look as young as I used to look, which is whack, because I never liked how I looked until the last couple of years, but I digress), but I don't object. It still means respect to me. (And in the military, "Ma'am" is used for women, as opposed to "Sir" for men.) I would err on the side of saying Ma'am aloud (as I would say Sir), and asking about "Ms" on a person-by-person basis. Or erring on the side of Ms. I would write Mrs if I knew the woman used that for herself. Though in our current culture, such formality with the written word has become nearly obsolete. I didn't use Mr or Ms OR Mrs on any of my wedding invitations, for example, and that seemed normal to me (and no one made any comments about it).my name is Amandahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15484587200951022679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-59670098165364639482012-02-27T08:37:34.959-08:002012-02-27T08:37:34.959-08:00Yeah, I know...generations, though...
Also urban ...Yeah, I know...generations, though...<br /><br />Also urban vs. suburban vs. small town vs. university community, etc...<br /><br />My point is that etiquette isn't a fixed point. So it doesn't follow that someone else's different or evolving expectations are less valid than your own, whether you've been "corrected" or not.Brianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06799024060528185282noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-25379083159285138712012-02-26T22:09:37.783-08:002012-02-26T22:09:37.783-08:00brian: i been out west since 67. Miss or Ma'am...brian: i been out west since 67. Miss or Ma'am its always been with me, and nobody has attempted to set me right... cept Ms S-.<br /><br />generationally older mexicans occasionally do call me 'mijo' though...still.<br />and had a few vietnamese call me brother. (its their cultural norm)Ginohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09606046924332159076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-48462166180052137862012-02-26T19:31:42.360-08:002012-02-26T19:31:42.360-08:00I think I'd go to great lengths to avoid using...I think I'd go to great lengths to avoid using "Ms." It's good to be polite, certainly. But who wants to be co-opted into someone else's "innovations"? That said, I wouldn't call Amanda Miss or Mrs. if she didn't desire it.W.B. Picklesworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03187309512838841997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-5798855876840385282012-02-26T16:29:01.314-08:002012-02-26T16:29:01.314-08:00Few things are more quintessentially French than m...Few things are more quintessentially French than micromanaging the language. <br /><br /><i>i'm just being polite according to the cultural norms in which i was raised.</i><br /><br />That's a fine place to start, but sometimes politeness dictates an attempt to be polite by the cultural norms of the people with whom you are interacting. Particularly if you are in their country, or in some cases here, their part of the country. <br /><br />That can also apply across generations, in certain scenarios. <br /><br />A couple of examples: <br /><br />1. I grew up with "ma'am" and "sir" drilled into my head. Hard. If my dad says my name, 90% of the time I'll <i>still</i> respond with "sir?" <br /><br />When I moved out west (the first time), I got (metaphorically) beaten down for calling women ma'am. When I moved back to the southeast, I found myself code-switching depending on whether I was talking to fellow transplants (which I was, by this point) or the "natives". <br /><br />Back out west to Seattle, no more "ma'am", <i>except</i> on the occasion when I am speaking with a woman who is at least as old as my mother. <br /><br />Regardless of region, I don't know a single woman born since about 1970 or so that likes being called "ma'am" by anyone. <br /><br />2. In the US, when you enter a business and aren't ready to interact with anyone (say you're just browsing), in most places clerks will leave you alone. Or if they greet you, you can just smile, nod, or otherwise non-verbally acknowledge them, and by doing so, signal that you aren't really ready to talk with them yet. And most of the time this is just fine. <br /><br />When you enter a shop in France, you will <i>always</i> be greeted with "bonjour". And there is a very, very real expectation that you will respond with the same. If you fail to do that, don't be surprised if you get treated rather coldly when you do decide to speak with them. <br /><br />It took me a good week in Paris before I figured this out. And therein lies a very easy misunderstanding, the result of which is both French shopkeepers and American tourists thinking the other group is generally rude, when in fact both are just operating under their own (slightly) different assumptions about what is polite.Brianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06799024060528185282noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-11488484516749979672012-02-26T16:09:05.863-08:002012-02-26T16:09:05.863-08:00I try to keep it simple - sir or ma'am for any...I try to keep it simple - sir or ma'am for anyone. Or dude. Dude is surprisingly useful.Mr. Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920907647566015611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-68273842180444203902012-02-26T08:36:44.465-08:002012-02-26T08:36:44.465-08:00amanda: puposely offending? no, Ma'am. i'm...amanda: puposely offending? no, Ma'am. i'm just being polite according to the cultural norms in which i was raised. havent had any complaints yet.Ginohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09606046924332159076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6875716674621937836.post-37804611659832263392012-02-26T02:54:17.607-08:002012-02-26T02:54:17.607-08:00You are arguing in support of purposely offending ...You are arguing in support of purposely offending women with terms they do not wish to be applied to themselves?<br /><br />Aside from that, these anecdotes are quite generational. Nearly all my lady friends use "Ms," including the married ones. Oh, and including when they were in their 20s.<br /><br />I would respond by fake-threatening to use the derogatory terms for unmarried men as a retaliation. But there aren't any.my name is Amandahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15484587200951022679noreply@blogger.com